In the end, what you are saying about role models looks similar to what I mean about people we can admire for their individual strength.

The reason I refuse to look up to any particular role model is exactly because of what you said. To me, nobody is perfect and to idolize people because of their status, riches, achievements, connections and what not would be totally wrong to me.

Like you, I admire people for their individual strength’s and character traits they have if that makes more sense. In the end, I think we talk about the same thing just in a slightly different way.

But here’s a real kicker… in the mid nineties the debate (arguments, fights?) about if the internet should be open to commercial interests were even more heated than today’s MMO issues. Many wanted it to remain totally non-business. Well, we know who won.

I think the bigger issue is basic human ethics. Environments and conditions will change and everytime this happens some sort of debate will pop up… often, heated. Principle, then, should be the guiding force, not the rules set up by the established system.

I personally haven’t bought Comm’s product (how many us commenting have?), so I can’t comment specifically about it or the service. If his product don’t live up to standard, then the marketplace should determine if his product live or die - provided, of course, he has a real guarantee.

My two bits… and I love all the different views.

I admire Donald Trump for his accomplishments however I would hardly say he’s a role model.

I can even say I admire Joel Comm in a way because he is very good at what he does but I wouldn’t want to do it for myself.

I get what you are saying but I just think you can have many different kinds of role models, you don’t have to admire them in their ENTIRETY but you can take bits and pieces from a lot of different people and make them your own.

My 2 cents.

As for Westcoast’s last statement on who to look up to I have to say, that I hardly look up to anybody. Just because somebody made millions online doesn’t mean he/she is a decent human being.

Unfortunately all too often we tend to associate success with greatness and follow these people to the end of the world and back.

People I look up to are those who have defeated sickness, death, poverty and disaster and lived to tell the tale. These people are the real heroes for me.

As for the rest, I admire people for their integrity, willingness to give unconditionally and honesty, regardless whether they are successful or not.

Spirit I believe is perhaps the right word.

My interpertation was indeed wrong.
Not afraid to admit it.

It is interesting how one can carry “baggage” from
one blog and posts to another and have it affect the thought process.

I carefully reread your article and you do not
make any statement that making money online is wrong.

I went back to Mark’s (45n5) and reread some of those posts.
It seems that the consensus, without a doubt, is that Joel Comm screwed up big time. He did, this time for whatever the reasons and the result was confusing and thus negative.

I was curious if anyone else had any other examples where
Joel screwed up to justify such vehement characterizations of Joel as a scammer?

I am also curious as to whom we should look up to as successful and experienced leaders in internet marketing?

I would think someone who has forged the way and maintains a sustained success both monetarily and by helping to educate others would be a good example.

Education is the regurgitation of information with a clear presentation.

I found some other marketers do the tactic. I bought a lot of stuff in the past. So, they used this tactic to optimize their income.

I never bought Joel’s product. Just now, I review his salesletter. THere’s 2 option. With 29.95 or without.
Maybe they have change it.

ok. That’s all.

You find it ironic that someone with a MMO blog could write an article about sleazy internet marketers.

If this is the case then you have made my point for me, which is that even honest MMOers are painted with the same brush due to sleazeball marketing tactics like Joel used.

I don’t do a lot traditional Internet Marketing as niche sites and blogging is more my thing right now. This may come as a shock to some, but you can make money online without lying, cheating or stealing people’s money.

Shocking….I know.